BodyRecomposition Support Forums  

Go Back   BodyRecomposition Support Forums > General information > Supplements
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #931  
Unread 04-28-2014, 02:29 PM
Primalkid Primalkid is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 2,239
Default

DNP increases the metabolic cost of everything, from activity to just staying alive. And the 11% boost is per 100mg taken after it has built up in your system (about 4-6 days). So an acute dosage of 100mg won't get you 11%, but taking it for a week will.
Reply With Quote
  #932  
Unread 04-28-2014, 02:32 PM
LyleRB LyleRB is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Canada
Posts: 155
Default

I've read the same stuff and according to my calories is vs weight lost, it seems consistent to me, my diet was below maintenance by around 3-400kcal, saying that I was losing 1lb/day on average.
Reply With Quote
  #933  
Unread 04-28-2014, 06:01 PM
niloluiz niloluiz is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 264
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by funkypigeon View Post
Ive got a question though, niloluiz i think it was you who posted a study showing that 100mg = 11% increase in metabolism. If im correct i cant seem to find it anywhere would you mind reposting it?
Short answer: as always, read the thread. all of it

The link for the original research plus the the graph and explanations are on his thread, I believe somewhere around pages 10-50. As I always keeping saying, anyone using or seriously considering using DNP must read this topic from the beginning as it sums up all the relevant info available on this subject, especially what everybody needs to know about Peripheral Neuropathy induced by DNP (a potential side-effect).

Quote:
I am just asking because over at Uk-muscle the general consensus is that 100mg = 11% on day 1 and then on day 2 if you were to take another 100mg your metabolism would increase by something like 15% due to the accumulation, i was always under the impression that it would take about 3 days before you reached the 11% increase in metabolism?
Most if not all DNP guides you will find elsewhere are all complete or partial rubbish and this is another example of why. The original research was very clear on this matter: 11% for every 100mg of crystal (sodium) DNP or 15% for pure DNP (aka "powder DNP") after accumulation meaning after 3~5 days. Your impression was correct and the article/guide you saw is sprouting BS it seems.

Quote:
For every 100mg of DNP, you will get a 10% metabolic boost
As I said above, DNP accumulates in the body. So, by Day Seven on 250mg, 420mg will have been accumatated. Now we need to add the 250mg dose for that day. 420+250=670mg
670mg = 67% Boost in Metabolic Rate - Let's call it 70% to make it easier
Wrong because those calculations are based on the erroneous information you saw in that guide.

The metabolic boost for crystal is, on average, 11% for every 100mg after ingesting it ED for a while. So 250mg crystal after 5 or more days will represent a metabolic increase of near 30%. A decent increase to be sure and 250mg is generally speaking a low/moderate dosage.

And as primalkid reminded, the increase affects all your energy consumption, not just BMR.

Quote:
Lastly, we need to factor in food. Let's take my diet above which is 2000 Calories.
4000-2000 = 2000 Final average total Calories burnt

This equates to a 0.7lb of fat burnt Every Day. On paper, this should be 1.5lb of Fat Every Other Day.
Is there any truth to this or is it flawed?
It's possible to achieve really big deficits (the kind only marathon-runners could usually pull-off like a 4k+ deficit on a single day) with DNP+diet+exercise but definitely not as a daily routine. However for any given deficit you create, regardless of the method (diet, exercise, drugs/DNP or a combination thereof) the amount that will be supplied by stored fat is never 100%. Even with hardcore fasting (acaloric/water fast) after all the metabolic adaptation (which takes anywhere from 2 to 3 weeks to consolidate) the maximum rate of fat burning doesn't go above 90%.

A safe estimative/ball park number would be to take your estimate deficit and multiply it by 0.75. The result would best represent the actual fat burned.
Reply With Quote
  #934  
Unread 04-28-2014, 09:03 PM
LyleRB LyleRB is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Canada
Posts: 155
Default

Excellent post, thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #935  
Unread 04-29-2014, 12:20 AM
noah_k noah_k is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 391
Default

Yes another excellent sumup.

And I get the frustration, but for folks "new" to dnp it's very easy to do a read through and forget a key part (mixup of if sodium is 89% or 75% of powder, there was 100mg/11% increase for.. sodium? or powder? immediately or accumulated? damn, why was the highest dosage lower on the chart again?) and have no idea where it was fully answered as topics kind of go in a weird cycle here, some with resolve many pages later.

Or it's easy initially to have it confused with contradictory or speculative material read elsewhere.

The answer is.. read it again. Which is quite time consuming. And sometimes you don't even know if it's answered, let alone when!

The problem lies in the format, an unindexed linear thread, just the one, to answer any and all DNP questions instead of an entire forum section. No way to revise or tidy, to highlight, summarize, search or index - no, we can only add more posts onto the pile and it doesn't matter the author or what is said.

I've found using google to be a much better way to quickly look parts up again, like so:

Search for cardio mentions in the thread:
Code:
site:forums.lylemcdonald.com inurl:t=20556 cardio
Search for PN mentions in the thread where nilo writes (anything between quotes must appear):
Code:
site:forums.lylemcdonald.com inurl:t=20556 pn peripheral neuropathy "niloluiz"
etc.

Of course, this will naturally be lost in these pages too.

Last edited by noah_k : 04-29-2014 at 12:32 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #936  
Unread 04-29-2014, 04:11 AM
funkypigeon funkypigeon is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by niloluiz View Post
Short answer: as always, read the thread. all of it

The link for the original research plus the the graph and explanations are on his thread, I believe somewhere around pages 10-50. As I always keeping saying, anyone using or seriously considering using DNP must read this topic from the beginning as it sums up all the relevant info available on this subject, especially what everybody needs to know about Peripheral Neuropathy induced by DNP (a potential side-effect).



Most if not all DNP guides you will find elsewhere are all complete or partial rubbish and this is another example of why. The original research was very clear on this matter: 11% for every 100mg of crystal (sodium) DNP or 15% for pure DNP (aka "powder DNP") after accumulation meaning after 3~5 days. Your impression was correct and the article/guide you saw is sprouting BS it seems.



Wrong because those calculations are based on the erroneous information you saw in that guide.

The metabolic boost for crystal is, on average, 11% for every 100mg after ingesting it ED for a while. So 250mg crystal after 5 or more days will represent a metabolic increase of near 30%. A decent increase to be sure and 250mg is generally speaking a low/moderate dosage.

And as primalkid reminded, the increase affects all your energy consumption, not just BMR.



It's possible to achieve really big deficits (the kind only marathon-runners could usually pull-off like a 4k+ deficit on a single day) with DNP+diet+exercise but definitely not as a daily routine. However for any given deficit you create, regardless of the method (diet, exercise, drugs/DNP or a combination thereof) the amount that will be supplied by stored fat is never 100%. Even with hardcore fasting (acaloric/water fast) after all the metabolic adaptation (which takes anywhere from 2 to 3 weeks to consolidate) the maximum rate of fat burning doesn't go above 90%.

A safe estimative/ball park number would be to take your estimate deficit and multiply it by 0.75. The result would best represent the actual fat burned.
Thanks niloluiz for that, think we may may have the next conciliator on our hands here hahaha
Reply With Quote
  #937  
Unread 04-29-2014, 06:19 AM
jigglypuffs's Avatar
jigglypuffs jigglypuffs is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,738
Default

People got together and made a FAQ on the GBR after many threads/posts discussed it.

Perhaps someone ambitious could be the local librarian and create the equivalent here.

That said, I don't know how much Lyle wants his site to be the DNP resource.
__________________
The only thing we have to fear, is fear itself. And bears.
Reply With Quote
  #938  
Unread 04-29-2014, 11:46 AM
tendency tendency is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 56
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Artie View Post
I got unstoppable cravings even with EC, after fasted YC it's even worse, when I'm leaving kitchen cause I eat everything what I see and consume 300-500kcal there so I can't eat nothing more with my macros some force of nature dragging me back and I eat more. Thank god I have only protein sources at home so I can't end up eating 2000kcal and 30p. Nightmare. May be I need to cook about 2kilos of veggies and eat 0.5kg every time I came into kitchen
as far as appetite suppressants go what happened to the 1950s housewife staple of good 'ol amphetamines? pretty much the gold standard.
Reply With Quote
  #939  
Unread 04-29-2014, 11:56 AM
noah_k noah_k is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 391
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jigglypuffs View Post
That said, I don't know how much Lyle wants his site to be the DNP resource.
I think this is the nail on the head. A few sites I know would not collate this information to the best ability or reach out to anyone for this reason. Moral ambiguity and media crucifiction
Reply With Quote
  #940  
Unread 04-29-2014, 12:56 PM
noah_k noah_k is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 391
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tendency View Post
as far as appetite suppressants go what happened to the 1950s housewife staple of good 'ol amphetamines? pretty much the gold standard.
This is the second time I've seen you've cheerfully suggested/encouraged speed to dieters as if it's a normal or relatively safe approach. It's not.

There are safer, legal, and more effective means of appetite suppression, from the mild ephedrine to the amphetamine related phentermine. Maybe consider knocking it off?
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:47 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.