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  #1  
Unread 05-10-2015, 02:43 AM
Nadoriel Nadoriel is offline
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Default Question about diet and refeeds

Hey everyone, I recently bought the book and it's been such an interesting reading. I started my flexible diet on the 30st April and I'm almost ready for my first refeed. I do have one question though.

First a few stats: I'm Cat 2 diet and Cat 1 exercise. I own a fitbit charge HR and do my maths everyday with that value in my mind. My diet is very moderate regarding carbs/fats/protein. Also, my minimum deficit on this cut is -10% of maintenance, though I've been doing a bigger cut than that most days.

I really want to make a refeed. From what I've read most people would probably not do it unless glycogen depleted which I'm probably not. But I do start getting mood swings usually on the 2nd week of dieting (has started already) and I started flexible diet exactly to help me accomplish fat loss without being awful to anyone.

According to my calculations, with the bare minimum for my stats I'd eat:
-Protein: 156g = 624cals
-Carbs: 377.2g = 1508.8cals
Thats around 2133 calories which will probably be a lot less than my burn for that day (I estimate around 3000 calories).

Does the refeed need to be higher than maintenance? Or as long as carbs are that high, fats less than 50g everything should work out fine?

Thank you!
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  #2  
Unread 05-10-2015, 01:43 PM
Nadoriel Nadoriel is offline
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Just to add, I'm doing a full day refeed (the 5h one gets me totally confused). Also some people say that refeed does need to be above maintenance. Why? And in this case, what should I raise?
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  #3  
Unread 05-11-2015, 09:41 AM
farrenator farrenator is offline
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Above maintenance for the physiological effects to be felt. However, Lyle has modified his thoughts recently on the physiological benefits of short refeeds, i.e., less than 3 days. He wrote about this in UD2 way back when he published it, and has solidifed his thinking on this over the years. He talks about this is a recent podcast he had. He posted the link to the podcast a couple of weeks ago.

Given that the short refeed may have little to no physiological impact, I'd eat whatever you have been craving and make it a maintenance or slightly above maintenance day. This would be to help your mood more than anything.
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  #4  
Unread 05-11-2015, 03:26 PM
Nadoriel Nadoriel is offline
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Wow, thank you so much. Just searched for the podcast and I'm listening to it. Sorry, I kinda found all this not long ago and didn't buy any other book than this one mainly because... well body fat of 29% so a lot to go still, even though I'm female.

In any case I'll jump carbs up to maintenance or even above depending on activity level and all that. The pity is... what I crave has both fat and carbs! Apparently not a good thing together.

Thanks again!
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  #5  
Unread 05-12-2015, 06:42 AM
farrenator farrenator is offline
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Carbs + fat are only 'bad' (if we can really say this at all) if you are above maintenance. In that scenario, carbs are burned preferentially by the body and fat is stored. By my thinking, as long as you are at maintenance or below, no/little fat will be stored. Enjoy a couple of slices of pizza or whatever tickles your fancy.
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  #6  
Unread 05-12-2015, 03:16 PM
Nadoriel Nadoriel is offline
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Ah, that definitely sounds reasonable. Well, too late this time, but definitely something I intend to try after the next 10-14d.

Can I ask you something else? After I read this book.. and comments on Lyle's other books I got extremely confused with what should be more or less my "macros". And I did read that Lyle does not agree with macros (which also makes sense) but unfortunately his guidelines for maintenance are very hard to follow in a cut. So if I eat my 156g of protein a day I still have fats and carbs to choose from. And I'm terribly confused whether I should go higher carbs or higher fats. If a refeed should have more carbs, then the cut surely should have less? UD2 from what I got from comments and reviews looks very ketogenic until the 3d refeed.

I do enjoy carbs a lot. And just from eating some fruit and veggies by main meals, it raises carbs to around 122g. I do like porridge though, and a nice little sandwich after a run. I haven't read everything Lyle wrote... yet. have you seen anything that says someone shouldn't have a lot of carbs on a cut because it decreases chance of losing fat? Specially if adding a refeed every 12 days?
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  #7  
Unread 05-13-2015, 10:10 AM
farrenator farrenator is offline
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You need to read these 2 articles:
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat...s-part-1.html/

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat...s-part-2.html/

Set total calories, then set protein, set fat, set carbs. The magnitude of your caloric restriction will determine how low you have to go on carbs and fat. Protein is a set amount, period. Don't deviate from that. That said, carbs help with energy and recovery so I tend to keep fat low and carbs relatively higher so I can fit within my caloric restriction.

UD2 is very ketogenic for the first 3.5 days, correct.

As far as the amount of carbs on a cut - first of all, I am no expert. But, my thinking is that if you are in a deficit, your body is burning calories from all sources - carbs, protein (muscle) and fat. Keeping protein high and lifting weights provides the substrate and signaling to your body to maintain lean body mass. Therefore your body starts consuming carbs + fat for energy. The lower the carbs, the more you skew consumption to fat because calories have to come from somewhere.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nadoriel View Post
Ah, that definitely sounds reasonable. Well, too late this time, but definitely something I intend to try after the next 10-14d.

Can I ask you something else? After I read this book.. and comments on Lyle's other books I got extremely confused with what should be more or less my "macros". And I did read that Lyle does not agree with macros (which also makes sense) but unfortunately his guidelines for maintenance are very hard to follow in a cut. So if I eat my 156g of protein a day I still have fats and carbs to choose from. And I'm terribly confused whether I should go higher carbs or higher fats. If a refeed should have more carbs, then the cut surely should have less? UD2 from what I got from comments and reviews looks very ketogenic until the 3d refeed.

I do enjoy carbs a lot. And just from eating some fruit and veggies by main meals, it raises carbs to around 122g. I do like porridge though, and a nice little sandwich after a run. I haven't read everything Lyle wrote... yet. have you seen anything that says someone shouldn't have a lot of carbs on a cut because it decreases chance of losing fat? Specially if adding a refeed every 12 days?
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  #8  
Unread 05-13-2015, 02:46 PM
Nadoriel Nadoriel is offline
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Geez, so close and so far away! Just read those two articles and intend to read a few more highlighted in them. Very elucidating, no more doubts. I've been on a "diet" for 3 years successfully while either cutting or maintaining, and was willing to let that go based on poor reading.

Thank you so much!!
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  #9  
Unread 05-14-2015, 07:19 AM
farrenator farrenator is offline
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Spend some time reading the FREE articles on the main site. Turning off the noise and sticking to the basics works most of the time. Good luck.
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