BodyRecomposition Support Forums  

Go Back   BodyRecomposition Support Forums > General information > Articles on the Main Site
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Unread 10-21-2018, 09:43 AM
lylemcdonald lylemcdonald is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,175
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadkill View Post
Sorry, english is not my 1st language and i worded it really weird last night. Lets try again: in part 3 in the section The Generic Bulking Routine you put Lateral Raises as 3-4 sets with 6-8 reps and 3 minutes rest, why this heavy, isnt isolation work for lateral delts supossed to be done for higher reps, same for rear delts?
I tought I had cahgned it to 2'.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Unread 10-21-2018, 01:20 PM
Ambitius Ambitius is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 40
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by w1cked View Post
https://rippedbody.com/intermediate-...lding-program/

eric's routine

quad- 18
ham-9
chest-11
back-13

...

hmm
The Novice Bodybuilding Program (programmed, by a reddit user):


https://imgur.com/2i9jQ2Y

It's not perfect mind you.

Lyle's GBR would reap some criticisms, too : low volume(s) for biceps, triceps, traps and shoulders, light deloads and coarse progression schemes.
People will ask : Depending on the exercise selection, the biceps would get too little volume (neutral grip on rows and overhand grip on lat pulldowns) using a underhand grip on all pull-exercises wouldn't be a good solution.
But for when he wrote it, like his refeed guidelines(50%+50%+50% ) on point.
I'm looking forward to a revised GBR, I could give some input if asked.

A good progression scheme would be Lyle's GBR and then Eric's Intermediate (5 days per week) routine.

Last edited by Ambitius : 10-21-2018 at 01:28 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Unread 10-21-2018, 03:40 PM
LightCrow LightCrow is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,015
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambitius View Post
Lyle's GBR would reap some criticisms, too : low volume(s) for biceps, triceps, traps and shoulders, light deloads and coarse progression schemes.
People will ask : Depending on the exercise selection, the biceps would get too little volume (neutral grip on rows and overhand grip on lat pulldowns) using a underhand grip on all pull-exercises wouldn't be a good solution.
But for when he wrote it, like his refeed guidelines(50%+50%+50% ) on point.
I'm looking forward to a revised GBR, I could give some input if asked.

A good progression scheme would be Lyle's GBR and then Eric's Intermediate (5 days per week) routine.
Itís called Generic for a reason, not you must do this exactly as written. Reduce/add volume as personal preference and needs arise. A good progression is GBR to Specialization, why would someone switch to a 5 day?

Iím sure Lyle canít wait to revise the GBR and get your input.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Unread 10-21-2018, 04:59 PM
lylemcdonald lylemcdonald is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,175
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambitius View Post
The Novice Bodybuilding Program (programmed, by a reddit user):


https://imgur.com/2i9jQ2Y

It's not perfect mind you.

Lyle's GBR would reap some criticisms, too : low volume(s) for biceps, triceps, traps and shoulders, light deloads and coarse progression schemes.
People will ask : Depending on the exercise selection, the biceps would get too little volume (neutral grip on rows and overhand grip on lat pulldowns) using a underhand grip on all pull-exercises wouldn't be a good solution.
But for when he wrote it, like his refeed guidelines(50%+50%+50% ) on point.


A good progression scheme would be Lyle's GBR and then Eric's Intermediate (5 days per week) routine.
Didja read what I wrote in Part 3 regadring biceps volume.

If oyu've done 8 heavy compound sets hitting biceps, please tell me HOW MUCH MORE DIRECT WORK DO YOU NEED?

Hint: not much.

I realize taht everybody comlpains about the volume being too low. Bros love training arms. Except for the people who say you don't need any direct arm work because compounds. trust me, a handful of sets on a base of heavy compound work is plenty and you don't get elbow tendinitis.

Same for delts. How much direct work do you need?

Yeah, I might bump it up a little bit. Maybe 6 sets/workout for 12/week which is PLENTY on top of other compound pushing work. But at 4 heavy sets on top of the other work, that's 8 sets. And hey, you dno't get freaking rotator cuff problems which is always nice. But do 4 sets of 6-8 and 2 sets of 12-15 on a lateral raise machine adn be happy. You don't need more, I promise.

Quote:
I'm looking forward to a revised GBR, I could give some input if asked.
Yeah, I'm really interested in the opinion of some internet rando who has done nothing to show even basic reading comprehension or knowledge except for a link to Redditt. Sure.
If you're so expert, write your own damn routine. Because as it is you're just an internet guy to me and nothing more.

That said, all workouts are a compromise of some sort. GBR works, has worked for about 15 years and noce it stops working, you move to specialization. Not add days.

To work upper means arms don't get as much volume. I ask again how much do they need after a lot of compound pushing and pulling.
Split it up and you run into sequencing issues and you get shoudler problems. Trust me, you do if you sequence it wrong.

This is what I feel s a nice middle of the road compromise on all aspects of training, frequency, volume, intensity. Everything else falls at a different extreme and this balances it out best to me.

volume is sufficient, intensity is manageable, frequency doesn't require living your life in the gym for 1% extra gains.

And I state again, if you can't get growth with this volume in general, the problem is not insufficient sets. It's you. Your lack of focus, technique, ability to work hard, to eat and recover well.

Dno't make up for your insufficiencies with junk volume.

Because if Dante can build monsters wiht 2-3 work sets every 5th day, this is enough for your lazy butt.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Unread 10-23-2018, 08:33 AM
spmurph spmurph is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 126
Default

Just wanted to point out that Eric's specialization cycle is in line with the volume recommended in Lyle's specialization cycle. Not sure why he linked Lyle's periodization piece, though.

https://3dmusclejourney.com/muscle-g...cycles-part-2/
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Unread 10-23-2018, 08:52 AM
w1cked w1cked is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,935
Default

A difference seems to be arm work is counted 1:1. Pulling 12 sets and curls 8 sets gets you 20 sets total.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Unread 10-24-2018, 06:07 AM
Ambitius Ambitius is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 40
Default

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four-sides_model I'll reference to it at the end.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lylemcdonald View Post
Didja read what I wrote in Part 3 regadring biceps volume.

If oyu've done 8 heavy compound sets hitting biceps, please tell me HOW MUCH MORE DIRECT WORK DO YOU NEED?

Actually, if you've done your compounds the right way like I doo, a lot !
According to Jeff Alberts,3DMJ-Coach, and lots of other elite coaches : using straps, Pistol-grip, cueing ones ellbows etc. dramatically reduces the tension on the biceps and puts it where it belongs.
I could also quote you, saying that direct x-muscle work is better than secondary - since "I've read everything you've ever wrote from the beginning of dawn". You were arguing in one thread regarding direct ab-work as I recall.



Hint: not much.

I realize taht everybody comlpains about the volume being too low. Bros love training arms. Except for the people who say you don't need any direct arm work because compounds. trust me, a handful of sets on a base of heavy compound work is plenty and you don't get elbow tendinitis.

Same for delts. How much direct work do you need?
As much as it takes to feel and/or grow them. Some people spent years on compounds never feeling(mind muscle connection anyone?) their delts, and start incorporating lat.raises or face pulls (EMG-Analysis, Bret Contreras - best side delt exercise)and they grow over night.

Yeah, I might bump it up a little bit. Maybe 6 sets/workout for 12/week which is PLENTY on top of other compound pushing work. But at 4 heavy sets on top of the other work, that's 8 sets. And hey, you dno't get freaking rotator cuff problems which is always nice. But do 4 sets of 6-8 and 2 sets of 12-15 on a lateral raise machine adn be happy. You don't need more, I promise.
That, I'll second. Cheers.



Yeah, I'm really interested in the opinion of some internet rando who has done nothing to show even basic reading comprehension or knowledge except for a link to Redditt. Sure.

Honey, there was no link to reddit it was a imgur link, you'd knew, If you've actually read it yourself (the inspiration came from a reddit guy), so much for reading comprehension

Maybe I'm an internet "rando" maybe you're an old weired man on serious mads who loves dogs and writes masterpeaces in the dieting literature. Ad hominem. But maybe that's not even close to the whole story.

But I concentrate on what you say, not who you are. You're writting what you write in your nice and cosy house, and I'm writting from a university (as my IP shows probably).

So I could care less, about someone who never ever did a study himself nor has a PhD. But I do care, because " I've read everything you've ever wrote from the beginning of dawn". Your ketogenic diet book should have been a PhD, someone should have given it to you. At least as a h.c. to say the least. (bet you didn't anticipate that level of objectivity after the beginning statement )

You know everybody knows how to critizise a study, but it's much harder designing one. That's what a fellow researcher told me, when I defended you against their conclusions...won't name names, but you can guess.

You know Lyle, I'd be happy to start a fund, to foster a project that you'll lead as the head researcher. In fact, design the study. I'll donate as the first person, no problem, and I'm sure lots of people will follow. How do you feel about that, are you "up to the challenge?" not passive-agressively writting flame-articles, but showing the best in the field how it's done ?




If you're so expert, write your own damn routine. Because as it is you're just an internet guy to me and nothing more.


there is a whole analysis of possible faults but it's in german, cannot be bothered to translate atm. Will do so if asked politely im private.



That said, all workouts are a compromise of some sort. GBR works, has worked for about 15 years and noce it stops working, you move to specialization. Not add days.

As a Generic Routine, it's great. Nobody could argue about that.

To work upper means arms don't get as much volume. I ask again how much do they need after a lot of compound pushing and pulling.
Split it up and you run into sequencing issues and you get shoudler problems. Trust me, you do if you sequence it wrong.

This is what I feel s a nice middle of the road compromise on all aspects of training, frequency, volume, intensity. Everything else falls at a different extreme and this balances it out best to me.
What do you think of Eric's Intermediate routine ?Which is what he came up with, of course after reading your GBR. If he didn't think it would be better, he would have just copied yours.

volume is sufficient, intensity is manageable, frequency doesn't require living your life in the gym for 1% extra gains.

And I state again, if you can't get growth with this volume in general, the problem is not insufficient sets. It's you. Your lack of focus, technique, ability to work hard, to eat and recover well.

Dno't make up for your insufficiencies with junk volume.

Because if Dante can build monsters wiht 2-3 work sets every 5th day, this is enough for your lazy butt.
Addendum : Eric et. al. blocked/baned/banished you not because of WHAT you said but HOW. Basic manners,education and nurture Mr.McDonald.
Look at the four-sides model, I linked above. Do your research on that topic.
I'll bet my savings of this month,if you'd appologize 'bout HOW you said not what you said, they'll start talking and responding to all your critics. Cursing people in emails or websides is so 90s style-ish....c'me on make the internet great again.

You cannot insult a man and then think he'll be open to the discussion. You've got a BSc from UCLA in kinesiology (exercise physiology) but that's just the basics of communication.

Again : take what is usefull reject what is useless what Bruce said, no matter if the person is a "random internet guy" or a professor..loves cats or dogs.

Last edited by Ambitius : 10-24-2018 at 06:10 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Unread 10-25-2018, 05:59 AM
alcahuetej's Avatar
alcahuetej alcahuetej is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 778
Default

In the middle of part 2 right now...

Wow, biopsies seem a bit extreme for a study looking at the ideal amount of volume for hypertrophy. It's not cancer research.

That being said, kudos to him for the thorough study, bummer for him that the data didn't support his theory though.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Unread 10-25-2018, 11:28 AM
HeavyLifting145 HeavyLifting145 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 91
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by spmurph View Post
Just wanted to point out that Eric's specialization cycle is in line with the volume recommended in Lyle's specialization cycle. Not sure why he linked Lyle's periodization piece, though.

https://3dmusclejourney.com/muscle-g...cycles-part-2/
LOL yea this look exactly like Lyle's spec article, Lyle what do you think of this? Your work just made a little more easier to create a routine from?
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Unread 10-25-2018, 11:31 AM
lylemcdonald lylemcdonald is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,175
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HeavyLifting145 View Post
LOL yea this look exactly like Lyle's spec article, Lyle what do you think of this? Your work just made a little more easier to create a routine from?
I don't care anymoer than I care about Rip opening a gym chain.

There aer only so many ways to skin a cat and most rational routines will look more similar than not. I just happened to have drawn these up years before the current crop of folks were anybody. And they just happeend to come up reading my work....
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:36 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.