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  #1  
Unread 02-03-2010, 11:42 AM
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jigglypuffs jigglypuffs is offline
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Default Zeltiq?

I should immediately start this off by saying I have no interest in this process, other than curiosity as to whether/how it works.

I was at the skin doc this morning and saw they had a poster up for something that claimed non-surgical spot reduction of fat, and then listed areas that were all alpha-2 fat areas.

Looking into it while I was killing time waiting on the doc to get me, it seemed to me that they make the area very cold, and then the fat goes away "as would normal dietary fat."

The SFP book, IIRC, noted that cold is bad for fat loss, warm good. (FIRE BAD)

So this seemed odd to me, and the only way I could theorize this works is that they freeze it, it breaks the cell wall, the fat gets out, absorbed into the bloodstream, and then you exercise to get rid of it.

But while that superficially seems to make sense if that is even possible, I don't see how they would do that without burning your skin, and if it is not a temp that would burn your skin, then wouldn't there be a home version of this?

Curious for thoughts on others on this.
Not advocating it or considering it (no clue how much it even costs) - but was curious if it was a scam or not - assumed it wasn't in that I was in a very high end skin care place (that also does plastic surgery and the like I believe).
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  #2  
Unread 02-03-2010, 12:05 PM
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Here's a video:

http://www.redorbit.com/news/video/t...602/index.html
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  #3  
Unread 02-03-2010, 12:13 PM
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If you type Cryolipolysis into PubMed you'll get 4 references if you want to look into them.
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  #4  
Unread 02-03-2010, 12:15 PM
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A medline search on cryolipolysis turned up these 4. Looks like there may be something to it

***
1. Lasers Surg Med. 2009 Dec;41(10):703-8.

Cryolipolysis for subcutaneous fat layer reduction.

Avram MM, Harry RS.

Dermatology Laser & Cosmetic Center, Massachusetts General Hospital, Boston,
Massachusetts 02114, USA. mavram@partners.org

BACKGROUND AND OBJECTIVE: Cryolipolysis is a unique non-invasive method for the
selective reduction of fat cells with controlled, localized cooling. It is
important, therefore, to understand the potential efficacy and safety of this new
procedure for fat layer reduction. MATERIALS AND METHODS: A review of the
literature associated with cryolipolysis was performed to evaluate the findings
from pre-clinical and clinical studies with respect to the mechanism of action,
efficacy, and safety. RESULTS: Cryolipolysis has demonstrated efficacy in both
human and animal studies. Histology findings also confirm the selective reduction
of fat in both humans and animals, with evidence of a gradual thinning of the fat
layer over a period of two to four months. Importantly, cryolipolysis has not
produced any significant adverse side effects in studies to date and any noted
effects have been minor and temporary. CONCLUSION: Although the mechanism of
action for cryolipolysis is not yet completely understood, the efficacy and
safety of this non-invasive procedure for fat layer reduction has been
demonstrated in the studies available to data. Further studies willl assist in
identifying the mechanism and elucidate the full potential of this technology to
perform safe, non-invasive fat reduction for areas of local fat accumulation.
Copyright 2009 Wiley-Liss, Inc.

PMID: 20014262 [PubMed - in process]


2. Lasers Surg Med. 2009 Dec;41(10):785-90.

Non-invasive cryolipolysis for subcutaneous fat reduction does not affect serum
lipid levels or liver function tests.

Klein KB, Zelickson B, Riopelle JG, Okamoto E, Bachelor EP, Harry RS, Preciado
JA.

Endpoint LLC, Bainbridge Island, Washington 98110, USA.

BACKGROUND AND OBJECTIVE: Cryolipolysis provides a method of non-invasive fat
reduction that significantly reduces subcutaneous fat without injury to adjacent
tissues. Preliminary animal and human data have suggested that cryolipolysis has
no effect on serum lipid profiles or liver tests. This study was intended to more
fully document any effect of this procedure on lipid and liver-related blood
tests. STUDY DESIGN/MATERIALS AND METHODS: Forty subjects with fat bulges on
their flanks ("love handles") were treated bilaterally with a non-invasive device
(Zeltiq Aesthetics, Pleasanton, CA) that precisely cools tissue to achieve a
reduction in the fat layer. Serum lipid levels and liver tests were measured
prior to treatment, and at 1 day and 1, 4, 8, and 12 weeks post-treatment.
RESULTS: No meaningful changes in mean values were observed for any blood lipid
level or liver test at any point over the 12-week follow-up period. CONCLUSION:
Cryolipolysis, when used for reduction of subcutaneous flank fat, is not
associated with changes in serum lipids or liver test results. Copyright 2009
Wiley-Liss, Inc.

PMID: 20014252 [PubMed - in process]


3. Dermatol Surg. 2009 Oct;35(10):1462-70. Epub 2009 Jul 13.

Cryolipolysis for noninvasive fat cell destruction: initial results from a pig
model.

Zelickson B, Egbert BM, Preciado J, Allison J, Springer K, Rhoades RW, Manstein
D.

Department of Dermatology, University of Minnesota Medical School, Minneapolis,
Minnesota, USA. zelic002@earthlink.net

BACKGROUND: Liposuction is one of the most frequently performed cosmetic
procedures in the United States, but its cost and downtime has led to the
development of noninvasive approaches for adipose tissue reduction. OBJECTIVE: To
determine whether noninvasive controlled and selective destruction of fat cells
(Cryolipolysis) can selectively damage subcutaneous fat without causing damage to
the overlying skin or rise in lipid levels. METHODS: Three Yucatan pigs underwent
Cryolipolysis at 22 sites: 20 at cooling intensity factor (CIF) index 24.5 (-43.8
mW/cm(2)), one at CIF 24.9 (-44.7 mW/cm(2)), and one at CIF 25.4 (-45.6
mW/cm(2)). Treated areas were evaluated using photography, ultrasound, and gross
and microscopic pathology. Lipids were at various times points. One additional
pig underwent Cryolipolysis at various days before euthanasia. RESULTS: The
treatments resulted in a significant reduction in the superficial fat layer
without damage to the overlying skin. An inflammatory response triggered by
cold-induced apoptosis of adipocytes preceded the reduction in the fat layer.
Evaluation of lipids over a 3-month period following treatment demonstrated that
cholesterol and triglyceride values remained normal. CONCLUSIONS: Cryolipolysis
is worthy of further study because it has been shown to significantly decrease
subcutaneous fat and change body contour without causing damage to the overlying
skin and surrounding structures or deleterious changes in blood lipids.

PMID: 19614940 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


4. Aesthetic Plast Surg. 2009 Jul;33(4):482-8. Epub 2009 Mar 19.

Clinical efficacy of noninvasive cryolipolysis and its effects on peripheral
nerves.

Coleman SR, Sachdeva K, Egbert BM, Preciado J, Allison J.

Department of Surgery, NYU School of Medicine, 44 Hudson Street, New York, NY
10013, USA. LipoStructure@yahoo.com

BACKGROUND: Cryolipolysis provides a method for noninvasive fat reduction that
significantly reduces subcutaneous fat in a pig model without apparent damage to
skin and surrounding structures. This study aimed to determine whether fat
reduction in humans caused by cold exposure is associated with alteration in
local sensory function or nerve fibers. METHODS: In this study, 10 subjects were
treated with a prototype cooling device. Fat reduction was assessed in 9 of the
10 subjects via ultrasound before treatment and at the follow-up visit. Sensory
function was assessed by neurologic evaluation (n = 9), and biopsies (n = 1) were
collected for nerve staining. RESULTS: Treatment resulted in a normalized fat
layer reduction of 20.4% at 2 months and 25.5% at 6 months after treatment.
Transient reduction in sensation occurred in six of nine subjects assessed by
neurologic evaluation. However, all sensation returned by a mean of 3.6 weeks
after treatment. Biopsies showed no long-term change in nerve fiber structure.
There were no lasting sensory alterations or observations of skin damage in any
of the subjects evaluated. CONCLUSION: Noninvasive cryolipolysis results in
substantial fat reduction within 2 months of treatment without damage to skin.
The procedure is associated with modest reversible short-term changes in the
function of peripheral sensory nerves.

PMID: 19296153 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
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  #5  
Unread 02-09-2010, 02:52 PM
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jigglypuffs jigglypuffs is offline
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Amusingly, since I don't plan on doing this, I still keep thinking about it and reading what I can find.

I saw one write-up where someone claims to have lost 6 inches from their waistline in a single session of this thing. Granted, that person would have to have been fat to start with (since I'm at a 31 now, losing 6" would put me at a 25, which would probably kill me).

Even if a huge percentage of that was just water and magic, the amount of fat released in that would be huge, and it would only "go away" if oxidized. (as it is not excreted as waste)
If not oxidized, then it is just going to go right back into fat (and in theory could go from one fat area to a worse one - non-stubborn to stubborn - but if you have 6" on your waist to lose, I suppose that's the least of your concerns at the time).

They say in the articles that they have them walk on a treadmill for an hour after each session.
If they walk pretty slowly, that's about 200 calories burned, and if they really have a decent clip/incline, then they might get as many as 600 calories (from my own experience) - otherwise it is no longer walking (and the intensity may then push them out of fat burning).

So even at best, 600 calories, 1/5th of a pound of fat - which means only a very small fraction of what is released.
Assuming that what is released is also massively more than what one usually gets on average say on a low carb diet, this seems extremely unhealthy to me.
(again, I don't think anyone is using this for health purposes)

Some questions that arose while pondering this (I get *really* bored doing cardio):
1) how many calories are burned during a single SFP 2.0 session? (looking at the times/intensities - I am guessing that 1k is not unattainable, if not more, and 500 is probably definite)
2) how much fat is released during a low carb diet during waking hours?
3) how much does #2 change when you add Yohimbe?


I would think if you did Zeltiq, one would want to carb depelete for at least 2-4 days before hand, have already been doing LISS for a few months to get your body used to the stuff, maybe hit DNP for two days prior and through the process, and then walk WAY more than an hour immediately after the procedure - basically walk a marathon.

Otherwise you are basically paying a ton of money to take an unhealthy amount of fat out of your system at once, and redistribute it elsewhere (as not all of it can go immediately back to where it was, since there is supposedly some damage to the cells that takes time/energy to recovery from).

Anyway, yeah - that's the sort of thing I think about while trying to kill time on the treadmill.
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  #6  
Unread 02-09-2010, 03:01 PM
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If the studies I looked at are indicative, the mechanism is actual fat cell death (at least in one of teh animal studies that's what was going on).

It's not lipolysis in the sense that you're asking about it. The cells die, get cleaved off and hopefully dealt with without causing a massive autoimmune reaction. But you don't have to burn them off after treatment relaly.

A study that came out Sunday on this said that it should only be used for small fat depots. someone is either going to die or get lupus if folks start using this for big fat deposits.
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  #7  
Unread 02-09-2010, 03:08 PM
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Oh! Interesting - I must have been following up on the incorrect things then - they (and the poster I saw for this in the doc's office that initially spurred this question) said that it was released the way "normal" fat was and burned that way.

Agreed - if it is actually cell death, on the level of someone losing 6" off their waist in a day (assuming that isn't an exaggerated figure, which it probably is) - that sounds horrifically bad for the body.

I would think (obviously incorrectly) that doctors would advise them to diet down first and use this for a final thing instead of starting off when you have so much still there.

Anyway, like I said - not doing this (if nothing else, I simply can't afford it) - but enjoy reading/thinking about this stuff.

Even if it seems I'm always wrong
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  #8  
Unread 02-09-2010, 03:09 PM
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I have the perfect explanation about the 6" drop in waistline... it didn't happen

Sounds like just internet babbling and exaggerated stories... What makes you think it's possibly legit?

The video that's posted above (or it could be a different one because I've watched a few) seemed to imply that a guy that didn't look fat in the least might need several visits to get rid of his love handles. I got the feeling that they could not kill that many cells at one time (for what reasons, I don't know).
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  #9  
Unread 02-09-2010, 03:12 PM
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I was initially confused on if they were simply mobilizing the fat or killing the cells as well until Lyle pointed it out.

Quote:
BACKGROUND: Liposuction is one of the most frequently performed cosmetic
procedures in the United States, but its cost and downtime has led to the
development of noninvasive approaches for adipose tissue reduction. OBJECTIVE: To
determine whether noninvasive controlled and selective destruction of fat cells
(Cryolipolysis) can selectively damage subcutaneous fat without causing damage to
the overlying skin or rise in lipid levels. METHODS: Three Yucatan pigs underwent
Cryolipolysis at 22 sites: 20 at cooling intensity factor (CIF) index 24.5 (-43.8
mW/cm(2)), one at CIF 24.9 (-44.7 mW/cm(2)), and one at CIF 25.4 (-45.6
mW/cm(2)). Treated areas were evaluated using photography, ultrasound, and gross
and microscopic pathology. Lipids were at various times points. One additional
pig underwent Cryolipolysis at various days before euthanasia. RESULTS: The
treatments resulted in a significant reduction in the superficial fat layer
without damage to the overlying skin. An inflammatory response triggered by
cold-induced apoptosis of adipocytes preceded the reduction in the fat layer
.
Evaluation of lipids over a 3-month period following treatment demonstrated that
cholesterol and triglyceride values remained normal. CONCLUSIONS: Cryolipolysis
is worthy of further study because it has been shown to significantly decrease
subcutaneous fat and change body contour without causing damage to the overlying
skin and surrounding structures or deleterious changes in blood lipids.

Last edited by Overkill : 02-09-2010 at 03:14 PM.
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  #10  
Unread 02-09-2010, 03:12 PM
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jigglypuffs jigglypuffs is offline
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Definitely agree

Doesn't mean my brain won't go off thinking about stuff to kill time.

I also do weird stuff like picture the topology of turning people inside out (the human body is a toroid, and in math there are fixed ways to depict inversion of a toroid, so I like to translate it to fat people on the treadmill next to me - what would they look inverted inside out, lol).

Yeah, I'm weird.
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