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  #1041  
Unread 07-13-2014, 06:04 PM
relos relos is offline
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Originally Posted by Taytay100 View Post
Guys, can any of you chime in with your experience with DNP and RFL? I'm doing it for 7 days, just started today. Just wanting to know what i'd expect
I could only last 5 days at -2k to 2.5k cal deficit a day till I fell into a sort of depression and lost motivation. I had, however, just lost a lot of weight from an extreme diet and was still lethargic from that so your results may differ.

The hunger wasn't even that bad TBH.

Btw, don't rationalize over-eating when it's over.
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  #1042  
Unread 07-22-2014, 05:45 PM
mikemike12 mikemike12 is offline
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Originally Posted by relos View Post

Btw, don't rationalize over-eating when it's over.
That should be the slogan of this forum...up at the top in bold letters
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  #1043  
Unread 07-22-2014, 06:03 PM
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elpaisita elpaisita is offline
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Guys, can any of you chime in with your experience with DNP and RFL?
Change that "and" to "or", and you'll be more likely to win at life.

I don't see any reason to combine these two, unless you literally have to lose a truckload of weight in a short time, e.g., for a photo shoot.

Not to mention, there's a sort of anti-synergy here. Remember, the effectiveness of DNP derives largely from its ability to disrupt the cycle by which ingested and/or stored carbs are converted to ATP. If you use DNP while you are on a VLCD and in a ketotic state, you're sacrificing a great deal of its effectiveness.
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  #1044  
Unread 07-22-2014, 06:07 PM
mikemike12 mikemike12 is offline
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Originally Posted by elpaisita View Post
Not to mention, there's a sort of anti-synergy here. Remember, the effectiveness of DNP derives largely from its ability to disrupt the cycle by which ingested and/or stored carbs are converted to ATP. If you use DNP while you are on a VLCD and in a ketotic state, you're sacrificing a great deal of its effectiveness.

DNP makes you less efficient at ulitizing fat for energy too, not just carbs.
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  #1045  
Unread 08-13-2014, 04:02 AM
Taytay100 Taytay100 is offline
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Guys, does DNP completely overrule any law in regards to insulin sensitivity, stubborn fat loss, low carb/high carb diets, how much cardio to do etc? Basically does it matter any approach you take in context to getting as lean as you please when running DNP. I've been reading alot of lyles articles recently, as well as his books regarding insulin sensitivity, calorie partioning and stubborn fat loss.. but i assume this only applies for the people going drug free and with people who are struggling to get rid of love handles, stubborn fat etc.
I assume that with DNP, you just make sure you are in a deficit?
I hope this question made sense, thanks guys.
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  #1046  
Unread 08-13-2014, 07:48 AM
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elpaisita elpaisita is offline
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Originally Posted by Taytay100 View Post
Guys, does DNP completely overrule any law in regards to insulin sensitivity, stubborn fat loss, low carb/high carb diets, how much cardio to do etc? Basically does it matter any approach you take in context to getting as lean as you please when running DNP. I've been reading alot of lyles articles recently, as well as his books regarding insulin sensitivity, calorie partioning and stubborn fat loss.. but i assume this only applies for the people going drug free and with people who are struggling to get rid of love handles, stubborn fat etc.
I assume that with DNP, you just make sure you are in a deficit?
I hope this question made sense, thanks guys.
There are exactly two things that are magical about DNP:
- The deficit/calorie multiplier
- Its muscle-sparing properties

Nothing else about it is magic. As far as things like stubborn-fat loss, it's akin to doing whatever you'd be doing anyway, but with the "fast-forward button" pressed.
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  #1047  
Unread 08-13-2014, 07:52 AM
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elpaisita elpaisita is offline
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Originally Posted by elpaisita View Post
There are exactly two things that are magical about DNP:
- The deficit/calorie multiplier
- Its muscle-sparing properties

Nothing else about it is magic. As far as things like stubborn-fat loss, it's akin to doing whatever you'd be doing anyway, but with the "fast-forward button" pressed.
What IS magic, though--and what doesn't get enough press, in general--is the calorie multiplier thing.

Other fat burners just burn extra calories--like a "debit" on your "balance sheet" of calories. But they don't fundamentally affect the calorie burn of other activities.
E.g., if a certain amount of walking burns 200 extra calories normally, then it will still burn 200 extra calories on EC/clen/yohimbine/etc.

With DNP, though, EVERYTHING that uses aerobic respiration/phosphorylation is affected.
If a DNP dose increases metabolic requirements by 20%, then EVERYTHING goes up by 20%. That amount of walking would now burn not just 200 but 240 extra calories.
(The downside is that it will also feel like it--i.e., it will feel 20% harder / 20% more perceived effort. That's why DNP makes you lazy.)

So, you can take advantage of this multiplier, but, if you want to burn stubborn fat, you're going to need a protocol that would have burned it anyway.
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  #1048  
Unread 08-13-2014, 08:04 AM
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lylemcd lylemcd is offline
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DNP ensurs that you won't have the energy or desire to do much more than walking so this concept is irrelevant as hell.
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  #1049  
Unread 08-13-2014, 08:10 AM
Artie Artie is offline
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Originally Posted by lylemcd View Post
DNP ensurs that you won't have the energy or desire to do much more than walking so this concept is irrelevant as hell.
It depends, some people will take this as challenge for short-term atleast. On DNP there's no motivation and will even going to the gym, but if you skip workouts systematically it will lead to some problems.
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  #1050  
Unread 08-13-2014, 08:23 AM
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elpaisita elpaisita is offline
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Originally Posted by lylemcd View Post
DNP ensurs that you won't have the energy or desire to do much more than walking so this concept is irrelevant as hell.
Not really. At what you've called "baby doses" it's possible to live pretty much like normal, with the exception of cutting back a bit on training loads and volume.

The sweet spot is the highest point where everyday tasks that increase TDEE are still no big deal.
It's stupid to go above that point, since the lost TDEE will offset the extra DNP burn AND you'll feel like a pile of caca (and the risks of neuropathy, etc. are presumably higher, though no one really knows).


This is one of the few instances in which a long history of severe sleep deprivation (~20 hours of sleep per week for about 20 years, before switching to my current schedule) was a blessing in disguise.
What you call "no energy to do anything" was just normal--every day of my life for two decades. By this point, I'd pretty much have to be bedridden to allow any latitude for fatigue.
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