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  #1  
Unread 11-08-2010, 04:19 PM
Nikola Nikola is offline
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Default "Negatives"

is it true that negatives or the lowering of the weight does the more muscle damage and builds more muscle?

yates keeps talking about negatives and how they are most important part of the rep. any truth?
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  #2  
Unread 11-08-2010, 04:23 PM
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lylemcd lylemcd is offline
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Yes ish.
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  #3  
Unread 11-08-2010, 05:13 PM
tayjeremy tayjeremy is offline
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Negatives is when there is constant tension and the fact that you can just "keep pushing BRO!" trying to maintain maximum tension and muscle breakdown....
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  #4  
Unread 11-08-2010, 05:22 PM
Dankid Dankid is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tayjeremy View Post
Negatives is when there is constant tension and the fact that you can just "keep pushing BRO!" trying to maintain maximum tension and muscle breakdown....
Umm? NO... Not sure if that was a horrible attempt at sarcasm or just plain stupidity.


Negatives are when you resist the movement of a weight, but it still moves downward. It is a form of exercise focusing on eccentric contractions. There are a ton of different methods, and some have merrit and some dont.

For the most part, the research suggests, that training focusing on concentric < eccentric < concentric + eccentric. So for the most part, people just do traditional training, and assume that equal amounts of concentric and eccentric work is the way to go.

Other than that, I believe the research and real world experience suggest that eccentric strength increases dont necessarily lead to concentric strength increases. So this is kinda evidence against the traditional method of negatives with supramaximal weights.
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  #5  
Unread 11-08-2010, 05:30 PM
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Judicious, careful, use of negatives can be great for muscle growth.

Overuse is more common, and can be very very bad.
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  #6  
Unread 11-08-2010, 05:46 PM
Myles.Buckley Myles.Buckley is offline
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chronic negatives vs an acute negative is a factor to consider too.

EDIT: chronic is part of Davids "careful" usage factor.
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Last edited by Myles.Buckley : 11-08-2010 at 05:51 PM.
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  #7  
Unread 11-08-2010, 07:33 PM
Zé Apelido Zé Apelido is offline
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The eccentric portion of movement causes more muscle damage and DOMS. Generally, when you are sore days after some training it is due to eccentric training. Of course you can only take so much.

Other thing about eccentric contractions is that one could sustain a higher muscle tension than during concentric contractions, perhaps up to 50% higher than what you could sustain isometrically. But perhaps the additional tension benefit is more neural adaptation.



But lots of heavy load negatives probably isn't too good for your heart.
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  #8  
Unread 11-08-2010, 08:25 PM
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lylemcd lylemcd is offline
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DOMS is not automaticaly related to MUSCLE damage despite the name
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  #9  
Unread 11-08-2010, 08:49 PM
Zé Apelido Zé Apelido is offline
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agreed, but I'd guess it's the prominent factor. and most painful
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  #10  
Unread 11-08-2010, 08:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zé Apelido View Post
agreed, but I'd guess it's the prominent factor. and most painful
Unfortunately, physiology is really not subject to guessing.

DOMS is most likely related to connective tissue damage and has nothing to do with muscle damage. There's been a good bit of recent work on this including one study pointing out that when you take a muscle biopsy, of course you measure muscle damage.

The act of biopsying the muscle damages it. Because if you biopsy the untrained limb, you see the identical damage to the eccentrically trained limb. So all of those early studies that saw muscle damage were causing it via the biopsy itself.
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