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  #1  
Unread 06-01-2008, 06:43 AM
des des is offline
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Default Cytomel?

In the book, Cytomel was also an option, but what about the dosing--is it based on body weight or depends on what the usage??

If you do decide to go the cytomel route, would you still recommend the yohimbine, or EC stack route--my guess is this is no longer necessary??

And what about the LTyrosine?? Should that be used regardless of the route you decide to go and should this be taken first thing in the am before fasted cardio sessions??

I am already on low dose syn. so just deciding which would be the best option to add on--I went into serious overtraining mode about a year ago, I have tried to up calories-stop exercising and wean off the syn. but body does not want to do that--so made up my mind to stay on syn, and now trying to get that darn stubborn body fat--which starting storing when my body somewhat shut down--already did the RFL and got alot of it off--now trying to up my exercise again--and looking for that edge--since it is obvious I don't have a problem actually dieting or exercising, haha!!

Thanks
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  #2  
Unread 06-01-2008, 06:52 AM
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Default Forgot to mention

They think that one of the reasons my thyroid gave me problems was because while in overtraining mode--which at the time I did not know I was in OV mode--my cortisol levels were pretty high--so my adrenals were affected--so Don't really want to take anything that will increase my levels either?? Gosh it gets so complicated---

I remember back in high school and running track and being on the swimming team--you just trained competed an never heard anything about the thyroid/overtraining/cortisol--of course way back then--Never talked about dieting either----Could eat whatever we wanted, right, hahha??
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  #3  
Unread 06-01-2008, 06:53 AM
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Go with clen instead. Much safer and less chance of messing up body chem IMO. I'm sure others will chime in.
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  #4  
Unread 06-01-2008, 11:37 AM
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clen and cytomel aren't interchangeable, completely different compounds

t3 dosing for non-hypothyroidal folks should be very low or muscle loss will occur (unless you have steroids). 25-50 mcg should be the most jsut about anybody would need, you'd need blood work to
dial it in much further than that
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  #5  
Unread 06-01-2008, 01:19 PM
des des is offline
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thanks for the reply, I was thinking of more 5mcg twice a day to start and see how I do, but would that be too low of a dose?? I am kinda small framed to begin with--just trying to get off that last little bit in thighs and little bit on hips

And would I then not need the EC/Yohimbine??

And what about LTyrosine, is that recommend still even on cytomel and I am also on Synthroid, can't forget that?? Would the Ltyrosine help in the possible muscle loss??

thanks
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  #6  
Unread 06-01-2008, 03:27 PM
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I think you're misunderstanding what cytomel is doing wrt: stubborn fat loss

don't just take it to take it, take it b/c there is a problem
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  #7  
Unread 06-01-2008, 05:07 PM
des des is offline
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I understand that, but my question is can the cytomel do the work alone or does it need help from one of the other choices?? This is not really explained in the book, nor are your answers very explanatory.

I did speak to an endocrinoligist and he did not think I needed a high dose for the results I am looking for, But I did not mention using cytomel in combination with the other things, well except for the Ltyrosine, which he says this is just an amino acid and can be used incombination with both the cytomel and synthroid
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  #8  
Unread 06-01-2008, 09:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by des View Post
I understand that, but my question is can the cytomel do the work alone or does it need help from one of the other choices?? This is not really explained in the book, nor are your answers very explanatory.
Go back and re-read the book; you're confused. By 'choices' you're referring to the supplements options given as part of the SBF protocols, right? Cytomel is NOT one of those options.

Cytomel is discussed in a background chapter discussing hormones and body fat, including the problems associated with low thyroid - and how, in that situation, exogenous thyroid hormone can help with fat loss (and a whole lot more besides, low thyroid can cause much bigger problem than simply a difficulty in losing weight).


Quote:
I have tried to up calories-stop exercising and wean off the syn. but body does not want to do that--so made up my mind to stay on syn, and now trying to get that darn stubborn body fat--which starting storing when my body somewhat shut down--already did the RFL and got alot of it off--now trying to up my exercise again--and looking for that edge
Look, take this the right way - I'm trying to help. But from what you're describing I think you're nuts for trying to use thyroid to "give you that edge" without a much deeper understanding of how the whole system works.


If you are currently prescribed thyroid hormones because your endocrinologist has identified a problem with your levels, then keep taking them. The idea is that they should bring you up to normal - and in that case then yes, they can 'be used' in conjunction with the stubborn fat protocols, and the supplement options therein.
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  #9  
Unread 06-02-2008, 07:19 AM
des des is offline
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Thanks for the reply Sarah, I have re-read the Stubborn fat loss book and you are right the cytomel option is in the part that is relating to the Thyroid, and for people who have sub-optimal thyroid function--which is my case!

I went into overtraining mode and I stopped dieting and exercising took a full break for about 6 weeks and my thyroid levels did not go back to normal, so I am on synthroid and even with the T4 meds, my Tsh and T4 went back to normal but my FT3 is still a low-normal--well I guess normal is 2.3 and my levels are like 1.9?? Not too bad, but maybe this is my whole problem to working out so hard and not getting the final results I want!!

So I understand what you are saying and maybe I am just asking the question wrong--my thing is??? I wonder if the cytomel is enough to correct my problem? and I wonder if I will still need the yohimbine or the EC, and do these options counteract with the Syn and cytomel??

So I ended up calling my endo yesterday and ran these options by him--He thought the Yohimbine would make me a little tachycardia and would have to really watch my heartrate and maybe not a good idea because of my cortisol levels getting affected when my body thinks I am in stress(Overtraining) And the EC, well he said this would be an ok option, but he would prefer me to just try the cytomel and caffiene for now and see how I do--He thinks that I will be happy with my results??

Thanks so much for your help--I understand you are only trying to help--it is just so frustrating trying to get answers when these supplements are so new to me!!! My husband is a Physician (Nephrologist) but does not deal with these things either-so could not really help me with out really researching--The good news is my endo is a good freind and has dealt with all the over the counter natural drugs/supplements and explained alot to me--I did not even have to buy his book!!!

Why even have a forum if you are going to be so short and shrude with your answers??!!
thanks Again!!
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  #10  
Unread 06-02-2008, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by des View Post
... my thyroid levels did not go back to normal, so I am on synthroid and even with the T4 meds, my Tsh and T4 went back to normal but my FT3 is still a low-normal--well I guess normal is 2.3 and my levels are like 1.9?? Not too bad, but maybe this is my whole problem to working out so hard and not getting the final results I want!!
How are you defining normal there - midrange, or am I right in thinking that you're referring to the bottom end of the range (something like 2.3-4.2)? If that's the case, I think 1.9 is horrible - no wonder you want to get it treated.

Your endo has explained about the conversion of T4 to T3? Obviously that's where you're having problems, if T4 is in range but T3 out. And that's why he/she's suggested the cytomel, right? To supply the T3 that your body is failing to convert?

Honestly - you sound fortunate. MANY people struggle to find a doc that looks at anything other than TSH, and maybe T4 - they won't consider FT3 levels and possible conversion problems. In your shoes I'd work with him to adjust the cytomel dose and get your FT3 back up into range ... and I WOULDN'T attempt to diet while doing this - there's time for that later, once you've addressed the thyroid issue.


How lean are you now? Are you genuinely at the point where you need the stubborn fat protocols - you're already very lean?

I know patience is hard, but taking the long term view honestly makes a lot more sense. Address the thyroid issues first, whilst eating at maintenance, and then try dieting and the stubborn fat protocols (and supplements). Better results.
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