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  #31  
Unread 02-23-2010, 11:36 AM
Myles.Buckley Myles.Buckley is offline
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But this is not about a maybe. It's not "maybe" the markets will crash. They will again sooner or later, and having stock that you can sell at anytime means you can minimize the losses. I sold it all when the US market started to go nuts. Here everyone was like "Noo that's just the greedy Americans, we're fine our markets are strong we have a unified Europe" and now some people have no retirement. No professional said sell your stocks because it's going to blow over. Of course all the professionals are still "very optimistic" because it wasn't their own retirement that got lost.

I'm going to bail on this one now, it seems the reality of the "professionals" is completely different from the one I'm living in.
You timed it right - I also dumped a bit before oil hit $110 USD / barrel. What I did after that was I got right back in when the mortgage debacle was happening.

From what I've seen most "professionals" are just folks that study markets and decide to play with yours and my money instead of their own (Warren Buffett excluded - he plays with HIS first, others 2nd).

Stick around - there's lots to share and discuss.

Last edited by Myles.Buckley : 02-23-2010 at 11:40 AM. Reason: another missspeeling
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  #32  
Unread 02-23-2010, 11:25 PM
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jp471 jp471 is offline
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But this is not about a maybe. It's not "maybe" the markets will crash. They will again sooner or later, and having stock that you can sell at anytime means you can minimize the losses......No professional said sell your stocks because it's going to blow over. Of course all the professionals are still "very optimistic" because it wasn't their own retirement that got lost.

I'm going to bail on this one now, it seems the reality of the "professionals" is completely different from the one I'm living in.

You realize you can sell a mutual fund at most within a few days? Like I said it's a bit beyond the scope of this conversation to differentiate between investing in stocks and investing in mutual funds that invest in stocks. All except something like a private equity fund you can be out of in a day.

You're right, crashes happen, and I'm sure they're gonna happen as the global economy grows and goes through changes....live with it. Doesn't mean stocks won't be higher in 20 or 30 years than they are right now. Which is where they most certainly will be.
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  #33  
Unread 02-24-2010, 04:45 AM
Elf Elf is offline
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You realize you can sell a mutual fund at most within a few days? Like I said it's a bit beyond the scope of this conversation to differentiate between investing in stocks and investing in mutual funds that invest in stocks. All except something like a private equity fund you can be out of in a day.

You're right, crashes happen, and I'm sure they're gonna happen as the global economy grows and goes through changes....live with it. Doesn't mean stocks won't be higher in 20 or 30 years than they are right now. Which is where they most certainly will be.
Even as part of a retirement plan? I figured that would not be possible, it's not possible here anyway. You are stuck with it until 65 (and maybe 67 or so soon) and if you want out you can buy off your retirement but that is not a very smart move.

But if your talking about mutual funds in general, you can't get around the fact that most of the time they perform poorly. People that just don't know anything about investing are possibly better off in mutual funds. But I think they do not give you the same control, if all my stocks suddenly dropped 2 points tomorrow they'd be sold. I don't think the same is possible with a mutual fund.

But I was not just talking about mutual funds in general, I was specifically talking about those part of a retirement plan because you are stuck with a retirement plan.
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  #34  
Unread 02-24-2010, 05:53 PM
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jp471 jp471 is offline
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Originally Posted by Elf View Post
Even as part of a retirement plan? I figured that would not be possible, it's not possible here anyway. You are stuck with it until 65 (and maybe 67 or so soon) and if you want out you can buy off your retirement but that is not a very smart move.

But if your talking about mutual funds in general, you can't get around the fact that most of the time they perform poorly. People that just don't know anything about investing are possibly better off in mutual funds. But I think they do not give you the same control, if all my stocks suddenly dropped 2 points tomorrow they'd be sold. I don't think the same is possible with a mutual fund.

But I was not just talking about mutual funds in general, I was specifically talking about those part of a retirement plan because you are stuck with a retirement plan.
If you have a retirement plan through work...i.e. 401k etc...to be honest I'm not sure...but I have never heard of anyone not being able to cash out of their retirement quickly in the event of say an emergency or just wanting to be in cash.

I know a few financial advisors pretty well....they do 401k's, roth IRA's the whole bit....and if a client wants to be in cash they can get them out of anything the day they call....with the exception of some fixed income w/ a set term...or of course a private equity fund (which are usually for higher net worth folks who are comfortable not being liquid).....if the advisor can't take a call the client has a broker number to sell directly. I'm pretty sure this is standard for going through any good advisor. One of the advisors I know actually just told me about a client who had 311k in a fund and wanted to go into cash....she called the banks broker and he didn't get him out of the fund till 3 days later and the client lost 12k....the bank reimbursed him the 12k.


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But if your talking about mutual funds in general, you can't get around the fact that most of the time they perform poorly.
Dude, this is really just a bias you have. Sure there are a lot of funds that may under perform the S&P 500 but that's really not a fair measure depending on what the funds invest in. If you chose to to invest in, say, the iShares Small Cap Growth fund, and small caps have a flat week while big caps rally a bit...naturally it'll under perform....but if you compare it to say, the Russel 2000 small cap index....it probably out performed.

Now, if you have a large cap fund and it under performs the S&P 500, then you have a bad manager. But really, thats not often the case. An index is just a collection of stocks. A fund of that index, or of similar stocks, is just another grouping of the same type of stocks. It literally would be more difficult for a large cap manager to under perform the S&P because he can pick what stocks within the S&P to take. If he consistently picks laggards he's not doing his job.... But if you're saying you can pick a group of stocks that consistently out perform a fund of similar stocks...i.e. pick say a group of US large caps that outperform most of the large cap funds out there, you should show your track record to any i bank and start getting paid. But to be honest, thats like me saying I'll drop less passes than the average NFL receiver. It's an easy claim to make, but in reality even the worst receivers in the NFL will catch more than me. It just looks easier than it is.
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